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Where are all Those Jobs ??
Strange how you libs are not talking about all those jobs the obummer is creating. Previously on these threads you touted the pseudo-job creation. Seen the latest job numbers? Pushing 8%. How about the economy? Now Lux, don’t go off on the stock market. You know well that the stock market activity has absolutely no correlation to economic health.
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792 Replies
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[b]How about the economy?[/b]
You see the Stock Market yesterday
You see the housing market picking up
You see jobs continuing to be added
What fng planet do you live on or better yet who is feeding you this garbage. Get to reality. The economy is not taking off like a rocket but its improving monthly
Is your hatred for Obama so deep that you wish otherwise? -
[b]You know well that the stock market activity has absolutely no correlation to economic health. [/b]
Where do you get this utter Bull From?
Just because you make up something stupid and say it does not make it true.
When the right wing doesnt like history………………….it just ignores it -
Quote from Point Man
Strange how you libs are not talking about all those jobs the obummer is creating. Previously on these threads you touted the pseudo-job creation. Seen the latest job numbers? Pushing 8%. How about the economy? Now Lux, don’t go off on the stock market. You know well that the stock market activity has absolutely no correlation to economic health.
Yes, I am on record as contending that there’s only a very loose correlation between the economy and the stock market. The market is much more fickle than the economy and it will utterly tank when the media simply reports bad news about any CEO of a blue chip or any 2-bit sound-bite that remotely hints at a threat to the supply of fossil fuels. That said, breaking 14k in the DOW does indeed indicate an optimistic sentiment from the big money houses which cannot be handwaived by you and other depressing Faux fans.
And it’s not at all[i] “strange”[/i] that [i]”libs are not talking about all those jobs”[/i] because it’s pretty much going the way libs expected it to go and libs don’t howl about every little thing the way you and yours do. Not everyone with a reasonable mind goes off half-cocked on their soapbox for the world to hear, Point Man.
The unemployment rate just release is essentially the same as previously reported. And as more jobs become available — BLS notes a significant increase in retail trade, construction, health care, and wholesale trade employment for Jan ’13 (losses were only recorded in transportation and warehousing) — more people who had dropped out of the job market re-enter the market and create artifactual inertia to the unemployment rate. This is a totally expected and healthy phenomenon. The BLS has stated that 119k jobs per month is the break even point in our current population and economy, and so 157k jobs represents growth as confirmed by the monthly data published by BLS in Table A, here, [link]http://bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm[/link] , and note the healthy “revised” numbers in the “+” direction every month except July and August.
Contrary to doomsayers like you, the economy is still moving in the right direction in spite of House paralysis.
Just imagine how much stronger the economy would be if the House ever pulls out of its destructive delusion about austerity.
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Yes Pointy this is what happens when you keep insisting that govt doesn’t create jobs then cut spending and cry about job loss…of course the whole cognitive dissonance is shown when Repubs cry over defense cuts because ‘gasp’ it will cost us jobs…
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How about the radiology job market and our declining reimbursements?? Oh Obummercare….
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[b]How about the radiology job market and our declining reimbursements?? Oh Obummercare[/b]
Tell me exactly how obama or obamacare has affected reimbursements?
And besides scare tactics tell me how it has affected the Job Market?-
[b]Affected the job market? [/b]
More compliance regulations mean less profits less expansion.
More employer mandated taxes.
Increase indirect costs to business.
The CBO Director testified to Congress Obamacare will result in a loss of 800,000 jobs.
National Retailers testified it would impact profit which impacts their ability to expand business.
Just to give you a side story a large local family owned retail business that has several stores in the area just gave letters to all their employees informing them that due to their rising costs as a result of obamacare they will be reducing most FT staff hours to PT hours making them no longer to be able to qualify for health care benefits. Only a limited number of employees will remain FT. They apologized to their employess but told them in the letter thay had to do it to survive.
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That’s bull Obamacare mandate haven’t even kicked in yet to any real degree
That’s a lie they are using to cut salaries and benefits
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Curious what is the name of the business?
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Of course the letter didn’t say that their profits were being siphoned by the Walmart in town…
The CBO also said that many of the job losses will be older workers who can now safely retire by haveing protected medical coverage-
Lets stop saying the Well I heard garbage
What is the name of the company?
Lets deal with some facts here
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[b]”That’s a lie they are using to cut salaries and benefits”[/b]
Kpack123
about jobs being cut because of Obamacare and you claimed it was a lie. Wendys (NE), Taco Bell (OK), and Stark State College in Ohio to name a few have all cut employees hours to avoid having to pay the benefits in response to Obamacare. You claimed it was not happening. There are companies slashing employee hours because of Obamacare just as I stated in my post on a local family company that was doing the same.
You can find the story by going to the Obama Broadcasting network MSNBC.-
Quote from Ixrayu
[b]”That’s a lie they are using to cut salaries and benefits”[/b]
Kpack123
about jobs being cut because of Obamacare and you claimed it was a lie. Wendys (NE), Taco Bell (OK), and Stark State College in Ohio to name a few have all cut employees hours to avoid having to pay the benefits in response to Obamacare. You claimed it was not happening. There are companies slashing employee hours because of Obamacare just as I stated in my post on a local family company that was doing the same.
You can find the story by going to the Obama Broadcasting network MSNBC.I can’t comment on Kpack123’s statement, but I can tell you that companies lay off while others thrive every day of the week. You can’t just look at the ones that are crying tough times and use that as proof that the economy is failing. You must also look at the ones who are hiring, making profits, and thriving.
My own organization has not let anyone go, and we haven’t hired anyone new yet, but we’re now on an upswing in profit and I suspect in another 6-12 months I’ll be adding more people to my workforce.
To assess the economy, you can’t go by anecdotes because in tough times the ideologues come out of the closet and try to sell their fear and paranoia to the lowest bidder. Rather, you need to take a step back and look at the indicators, like employment, new claims, housing, public confidence, international relations, and it’s hard to find many people today who doubt that all of those indicators are moving in the right direction.
In fact, the main argument these days is not that things are moving in the right direction – most people on both sides agree now that things are indeed improving – rather, they’re quibbling about whether things are moving in the right direction FAST ENOUGH, as if they have any basis for knowing how things could move faster than they have been over the past 4 years, especially considering it’s taken [u]DECADES[/u] for this mess to build up in the first place. Hell, it took Bush a full [u]EIGHT[/u] years to tear everything down, and we all know that “demolition” takes a lot LESS time than “construction”! And the extremist conservatives claim Obama should have been able to build this country back up to its former self in only [u]FOUR[/u] years?! What a pathetic delusion those people are clinging to.It’s clearly a childish argument by spoiled brats who didn’t get their own guy elected. They have no desire to understand why he lost. They are happy enough to simply hate the guy who won. And they think that’s a good enough reason to hold our country hostage by stalemating our government like a bunch of third world terrorists. By definition, they’re stinking traitors and should be sent to the tribunals for punishment, early and often.
Whew, that felt GOOD! lol
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Yeah the liberal media would never cover something like that….oh wait
[link=http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/08/1177236/-Wendy-s-franchise-owner-cutting-worker-hours-to-avoid-Obamacare-despite-backlash-to-other-chains]http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/08/1177236/-Wendy-s-franchise-owner-cutting-worker-hours-to-avoid-Obamacare-despite-backlash-to-other-chains[/link]#
So its nice to know that a couple of individual franchise owners (political affiliation?) would throw their workers under the bus for the sake of making a point. How much would they have to raise the price of a combo meal to accomodate this? Here is an example:
When Papa John’s CEO John Schnatter was trying to really scare people, he said his chain would pass along a 10 to 14 cent increase in the cost of a pizzaless than $22 a year if you ate Papa John’s three times every single week. But when [i]Forbes[/i]’ Caleb Melby did the math on Schnatter’s claims, it worked out to less than 5 cents per pizza.
So yeah some individuals will make that decision…some for political reasons and some for real financial reasons but quite frankly it will still be a large net positive for many more people to have health insurance -
I still claim it’s a lie
If I say the sky is orange doesn’t mean it’s orange
Obamacare whatever that is has not even started yet
These companies that claim to be slashing jobs are because of the Obamacare costs are LYING
There is no added cost because of healthcare at least yet to these employers because nothing has kicked in yet
This is like saying well in 2015 I’m going to pay more taxes……. So I’ll stop working now because of the 2015 tax rates. It’s 2013
It makes no sense it’s a political based lie
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[link=http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/09/business/economy/us-added-236000-jobs-in-february.html?_r=0]http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/09/business/economy/us-added-236000-jobs-in-february.html?_r=0[/link]
Unemployment at 4-Year-Low as U.S. Hiring Gains Steam
Bolstered by a healthier private sector, the United States economy gained 236,000 jobs in February, well above what had been expected, while the unemployment rate fell to 7.7 percent, its lowest level since December 2008.
The gains were broad-based, [link=http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm]the Labor Department said Friday[/link], with sectors ranging from manufacturing to business services turning in healthy results. Construction was especially strong, adding 48,000 jobs, a sign that the recovery in the housing market is beginning to translate into new jobs.
Public-sector employment continued to shrink, however, as the number of government employees nationwide fell by 10,000.
Here are some jobs …… private sector ones too. 🙂-
We’ll see how long that lasts, now that the House Republicans’ terrorist imposition of austerity on our population will once again risk a total free-fall of the economy back to the world of pre-Obama Draconia.
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[link=http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-13/workweek-tying-longest-since-wwii-spurs-hiring-at-u-s-factories.html]http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-13/workweek-tying-longest-since-wwii-spurs-hiring-at-u-s-factories.html[/link]
The last time U.S. factory workers put in longer weeks than they averaged in February, Rosie the Riveter was on the assembly line and American GIs were fighting Nazis in [link=http://topics.bloomberg.com/europe/]Europe[/link].
All those [link=http://www.auntminnie.com/quote/USWHMANS:IND]extra hours[/link] helped to drive five straight months of manufacturing growth in the U.S., racking up 52,000 new factory jobs, according to Labor Department [link=http://www.auntminnie.com/quote/USMMMNCH:IND]data[/link]. That includes 14,000 positions in February alone.
Production workers averaged 41.9 hours a week in February, Labor Department data showed last week. That tied December 1997 and January 1998 as the most since May 1944, when full wartime production was pulling more women into factories, as symbolized by the [link=http://www.nps.gov/pwro/collection/website/rosie.htm]Rosie the Riveter[/link] character in posters, song and film. The record was 45.4 hours in January and February 1944.
The hours were included in a report showing that employers added 236,000 workers to payrolls and that the jobless rate fell to 7.7 percent, a four-year low.
If the demand stays steady, employers will be forced to considering hiring for future needs, not just for immediate openings, said [link=http://topics.bloomberg.com/john-challenger/]John Challenger[/link], chief executive officer of Challenger Gray & Christmas Inc., an employment consulting firm based in [link=http://topics.bloomberg.com/chicago/]Chicago[/link].
This has been the classic start-and-stop recovery, so people were reluctant to hire, Challenger said in an interview. We are seeing a surge right now. As employers sayIts costing us too much, were losing talent, other companies may get the talent before we do, so we better get out in front of this, that leads to more hiring.
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[b]Yes, I am on record as contending that there’s only a very loose correlation between the economy and the stock market. [/b]
How do you substantiate this claim?
You look back at history and there is always a correlation, most of the time the Market predicts the economy 6-12 months in advance.
Also when was the last Bear market that coexisted with a great economy?
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Quote from Thor
Of course the letter didn’t say that their profits were being siphoned by the Walmart in town…
The CBO also said that many of the job losses will be older workers who can now safely retire by haveing protected medical coverage
You beat me to it. I was going to ask for that CBO citation because quips like that always have an undisclosed underbelly that contains the other half of the truth.
And as a matter of FACT, the CBO clarified that statistic a bit further by stating that it didn’t mean to imply that 800,000 [u]PEOPLE[/u] would be out of work. It simply said ACA would reduce the labor burden by 0.5%. It stated clearly that this reduction is voluntary by the workers and reflects (as Thor said) the decision to retire, or at least work fewer hours. The media and politicians were the ones who decided that it meant 800,000 people would be out of a job.
The CBO clearly stated that workers simply would not work [i]as many hours[/i] to pay the higher prices for healthcare coverage and the number of hours saved (equal to 1/2 of 1% of each worker’s hours) would be the [u][i]equivalent[/i][/u] of 800,000 jobs’ [u]worth of hours[/u].
So once again, by believing every shock sound bite that he years on Faux-Profit News, Point Man (not to mention Ixrayu) purveys the half truth in yet another attempt to stuff his own misinformed ideology down the reader’s throat.
Thanks Thor.
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Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good distortion
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Quote from kpack123
Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good distortion
Reminds me of the old line [i]”Do you want the truth…or an interesting story?”[/i]
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That’s why the republicans coalition is falling apart. Only the far right loonies that don’t deal in truth remain
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It cracks me up that libs are celebrating 7.9 and rising unemployment and $16.5T debt. You will really get “a thrill up your leg” when it hits $17T and 8.0% unemployment. Google all those obummer talking points and try to spin it, but bottom line your messiah’s performance is the worst of any modern POTUS. Maybe a few more of those “faked” skeet shooting photo-ops will make it all better again. You always got old fluker to be the voice of the left. You libs are really sickening.
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Obama clearly owns this sluggish economy. And its hurting his base, but they’re too brainwashed by mantras of classwar to even perceive it.
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Nobody is celebrating. And I yeah Obama owns it now
Just pointing out to you that the stock market is approaching an all time high
Housing market is improving
And jobs continue to be created not lost
It’s a recovery
It is was it is
It’s improving
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borat the obummer and Sen. Mitch McConnell walking down the street…
Mitch: “borat, what do you see”?
borat: “I see 3.5 million new jobs”. “What do you see Mitch”?
Mitch: “I see 3.5 million unicorns”
borat: “Now Mitch you know there aren’t any unicorns”
Mitch: “Yeah!! ain’t no jobs either”-
Stock market closed over 14000
Jobs are being added
Housing is picking up
Reality
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Quote from kpack123
Stock market closed over 14000
Jobs are being added
Housing is picking up
Reality
Stock market ?? Just China buying our misfortune
Jobs? Where are they? More unemployed people since the Great Depression
Housing? A real joke!!! Slimey investors picking up those forclusers to rent to the unfortunate masses.
Reality?? Get a grip on yourself, pacman. Ain’t no Santa Claus either!!!
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Quote from Point Man
Quote from kpack123
Stock market closed over 14000 Jobs are being added Housing is picking up Reality
Stock market ?? Just China buying our misfortune Jobs? Where are they? More unemployed people since the Great Depression Housing? A real joke!!! Slimey investors picking up those forclusers to rent to the unfortunate masses. Reality?? Get a grip on yourself, pacman. Ain’t no Santa Claus either!!!
Wow, what a thorough, objective counterpoint, Point Man. Par for the course.
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How about some facts Point man
How is china buying our misfortune causing the market to be at all time highs
Slimy investors buying foreclosures? Renting to unfortunate masses? Are u serious. First off this is capitalism. U smell a good deal take some risk then do it. Secondly what would you like the Banks to do? Eat the loans and give handouts to people…….. Then you be beatching about that
C’mon man bring some facts and reason to the table? Assanine and wild accusations don’t count
You are an example of why republicans are losing elections. No one believes the garbage anymore
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Quote from kpack123 (to Point Man)
You are an example of why republicans are losing elections. No one believes the garbage anymore
Thank you for that lucid exec summary.
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kpack, may I ask you a question? Why has the market rallied in the past 6 months to a year?
That’s the most important question as to the market’s link to the “economy”-
I believe it’s rallied because there has been a slow economic turnaround after a near global financial collapse
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Look where we came from in 4 years
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I believe it is because the government is pumping out money through QE making stocks a far better investment (keeping interest rates low) for now. The problem ultimately will be the devalued dollar. The market is not based on the economy as much as it is based on relative investment and runs … which actually does nothing or hurts the economy since people are less likely to invest in the real tangible inputs.
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Quote from Cigar
The problem ultimately will be the devalued dollar. The market is not based on the economy as much as it is based on relative investment and runs … which actually does nothing or hurts the economy since people are less likely to invest in the real tangible inputs.
I disagree with your assessment of the dollar. The devaluation of the dollar has the advantage that it will allow us to better compete with the economies of other countries since devaluing the buck puts us on a more even playing field and therefore offers many more opportunities to expand our trade volume with those other economies.
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Even if you devalue the dollar the rising market means more capital more buying power
Ok maybe if you scenario proves correct and remember yours is just a scenario by no means a law of physics just a guess like everyone else
Say your scenario does prove correct, the dollar is devalued ok but the market is still up so while a 10% gain or yield may not mean the same in today’s dollars it is still a gain
I don’t get the QE argument. To me it’s just a big so what that a handful of tea party type analyst are screaming
Doesn’t mean jack squat
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Quote from Cigar
I believe it is because the government is pumping out money through QE making stocks a far better investment (keeping interest rates low) for now.
I, too, don’t get your QE argument. First of all, quantitative easing is the only other viable tool once rates go essentially to zero. Second, it’s not free money, it’s money in exchange for bank assets’. It’s a transfer of assets into liquidity thereby freeing up funds for investments that can be infused into the economy as working capital rather than being locked up in non-liquid assets’ (this was my big problem with Romney sucking a few hundred million out of our economy and putting it into his personal accounts in Grand Cayman).
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How does QE explain the bond market?
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Is QE, or is QE not, a creation of money/dollars that wasn’t there before? It is. Increasing the money supply in this manner is an artificial injection of “wealth” which doesn’t do anything but devalue the dollar for short term emotions/rallies/”stimulus”
A devalued dollar only hurts the middle class since their buying power will be dramatically reduced when things like food and rent go up or even stay the same (real cost).-
Is the dollar devalued? Are investors running away from the dollar for some other currency?
I wasn’t aware. -
Quote from Cigar
Is QE, or is QE not, a creation of money/dollars that wasn’t there before? It is. Increasing the money supply in this manner is an artificial injection of “wealth” which doesn’t do anything but devalue the dollar for short term emotions/rallies/”stimulus”
A devalued dollar only hurts the middle class since their buying power will be dramatically reduced when things like food and rent go up or even stay the same (real cost).
That’s not at all my understanding of QE. QE happens when a nation’s “central bank” purchases fixed assets like bonds or other securities money. The central bank buys these assets with cash that provides liquidity which can be infused into the economy. The money could be the central banks money or it could be newly printed money, but the point is that it’s intended to be temporary in order to jumpstart the economy. The bank eventually sells the assets back for the cash it doled out as the economy recovers. Obviously there’s a calculated risk, but that risk is thought to outweigh the risk of doing nothing.
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Quote from Lux
Quote from Cigar
Is QE, or is QE not, a creation of money/dollars that wasn’t there before? It is. Increasing the money supply in this manner is an artificial injection of “wealth” which doesn’t do anything but devalue the dollar for short term emotions/rallies/”stimulus”
A devalued dollar only hurts the middle class since their buying power will be dramatically reduced when things like food and rent go up or even stay the same (real cost).
That’s not at all my understanding of QE. QE happens when a nation’s “central bank” purchases fixed assets like bonds or other securities money. The central bank buys these assets with cash that provides liquidity which can be infused into the economy. [b]The money could be the central banks money or it could be newly printed money, but the point is that it’s intended to be temporary in order to jumpstart the economy[/b]. The bank eventually sells the assets back for the cash it doled out as the economy recovers. Obviously there’s a calculated risk, but that risk is thought to outweigh the risk of doing nothing.
I agree that it outweighs the risk but that’s because it’s literally a dire situation. Neither we nor the Europeans can afford at this point to do anything BUT print money to balance the sheets. It’s not temporary. It will be ad infinitum until devaluation or catastrophe, probably in that order given the way the politicans act. The debt and monetization is totally insolvent. The bond market at this point requires incessant bogus endeavors BY the Fed.
Sadly, there’s only downside. The sooner you realize that the better.-
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTUY16CkS-k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTUY16CkS-k[/link]
Cute video that sums it up nicely. IMHO it comes down to whether you buy the feds line that it is going to eventually unwind its purchases of this debt. If it does unwind the purchases the effect will be it did not in-fact print money, if it does not it did exactly that. Place your bets accordingly.-
Someone is going to write an accurate book about how this endless bombast-laden campaigner elected by group-think, didnt give a damn about his historically poor performance in leading America. Its as if Solyndra or Tesla become the business model for the future of America (i.e. print/throw lots and lots of money at politically correct ideas and dont allow questions about it) and boys/girls grew up to aspire to be community activists.
“Obama’s America-The Perils of a Symbolic Presidency”-
Nice. Another fact filled far out right wing post by saddest rad
You have a reasonable debate going on about QE………. And way way way out of right field comes an attack ad based on absolutely nothing
Can’t you see this is why you guys are disintegrating slowly?
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Saddest, now you’re simply imagining things and then conjuring them into your own faux reality.
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Almost 250,000 new jobs in February. Upward revisioned January numbers.
Unemployment rate hold study at 4.9%.
Significant increase in the labor force participation rate by 0.2%.
Damn strong again. No recession coming.
(Good news for Democrats)
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Post Call. I pretty much agree with what you said
In essence it’s a decision made that could go either way. My question for those who don’t agree with it is this? I still think the Banks are sucking up this cash and hoarding a lot of it.
What else would you do if you were the Fed?
In a way it’s like the auto bail out. What do you do in a crunch time?
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Quote from kpack123
Post Call. I pretty much agree with what you said
In essence it’s a decision made that could go either way. My question for those who don’t agree with it is this? I still think the Banks are sucking up this cash and hoarding a lot of it.
What else would you do if you were the Fed?
In a way it’s like the auto bail out. What do you do in a crunch time?
Sounds spot on. If you can borrow money for 0 for seemingly foreverand without consequence why not borrow it, and leverage way up. Banks have been getting cheap money now for a while and have made bank riding the market all the way up. That being said I still think there is an amount of liquidity having to be kept by the banks due to those ‘stress tests’ or whatever. I was reading that the real amount of money given out by the fed was more to the tune of 7 trillion and not the TARP we hear about.
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I liked the FOX news story that the Obama Prez library was going to cause Reagan’s boyhood home to be torn down
These right wingers are creepy weird
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Fair and balanced baby
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Things will get better once Virginia shows the way with their new currency.
Show the Fed how it’s done!
Let’s see, will they print it (gold-backed, of course) or just mint it from gold and silver? And platinum.-
Oh boy!!!! Can’t wait to get my hands on some of those Virginia liberal bamer-bucks. Although they will be just like their namesake, worthless.
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Quote from Point Man
Oh boy!!!! Can’t wait to get my hands on some of those Virginia liberal bamer-bucks. Although they will be just like their namesake, worthless.
The heavily Republican House of Delegates passed it 65 to 32 this Monday.
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Are going to try to secede next?
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Quote from Thor
Yeah the liberal media would never cover something like that….oh wait
[link=http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/08/1177236/-Wendy-s-franchise-owner-cutting-worker-hours-to-avoid-Obamacare-despite-backlash-to-other-chains]http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/08/1177236/-Wendy-s-franchise-owner-cutting-worker-hours-to-avoid-Obamacare-despite-backlash-to-other-chains[/link]#
So its nice to know that a couple of individual franchise owners (political affiliation?) would throw their workers under the bus for the sake of making a point. How much would they have to raise the price of a combo meal to accomodate this? Here is an example:
When Papa John’s CEO John Schnatter was trying to really scare people, he said his chain would pass along a 10 to 14 cent increase in the cost of a pizzaless than $22 a year if you ate Papa John’s three times every single week. But when [i]Forbes[/i]’ Caleb Melby did the math on Schnatter’s claims, it worked out to less than 5 cents per pizza.
So yeah some individuals will make that decision…some for political reasons and some for real financial reasons but quite frankly it will still be a large net positive for many more people to have health insurance
History is full of companies that are too cowardly to cut staffing during good times because they are too proud (or too embarrassed) to admit they weren’t able to successfully navigate relatively calm seas. But give them any excuse to dramatize a tough situation so that they can use it as a smokescreen excuse, and they’ll come out of the woodwork to purge anything as ruthlessly as they can, and simply peddle it under the name of [i]”not my fault”[/i]. And Papa Schnatter is the poster child of such cowardly malarky, in my opinion.
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Quote from Point Man
Strange how you libs are not talking about all those jobs the obummer is creating. Previously on these threads you touted the pseudo-job creation. Seen the latest job numbers? Pushing 8%. How about the economy? Now Lux, don’t go off on the stock market. You know well that the stock market activity has absolutely no correlation to economic health.
[link=http://www.cnbc.com/id/100927524]http://www.cnbc.com/id/100927524[/link]
Looking pretty good. ADP non-farm payroll 200,000 for july. And there was an upward revision for June to 198,000.
Plus employment cost is heading up with it, meaning those are some decent wage earning jobs. Given the fiscal drag of sequester and 2013 tax hikes Id say pretty darned good.
Now, this might be negative for the stock market since it could be interpreted as “OMG, Bernanke is going to taper stimulus!” -
[link=http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-01/jobless-claims-in-u-s-decline-to-lowest-level-in-five-years.html]http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-01/jobless-claims-in-u-s-decline-to-lowest-level-in-five-years.html[/link]
Claims for jobless benefits unexpectedly dropped to the lowest level in more than five years, extending swings typical for the month of July.
[link=http://www.bloomberg.com/quote/INJCJC:IND]Applications (INJCJC)[/link] for unemployment insurance payments declined by 19,000 to 326,000 in the week ended July 27, the fewest since January 2008, from a revised 345,000 the prior week, the Labor Department reported today in [link=http://topics.bloomberg.com/washington/]Washington[/link]. The median forecast of 50 economists surveyed by Bloomberg called for 345,000. A government analyst said no states were estimated, and the data were still being influenced by the auto plant shutdowns that play havoc with the figures at this time of year.
Its a stronger labor market than anybody thought wed be seeing this time of year, said Guy Berger, an economist at RBS Securities Inc. in [link=http://topics.bloomberg.com/stamford/]Stamford[/link], [link=http://topics.bloomberg.com/connecticut/]Connecticut[/link], noting the claims data are affected by auto plant shutdowns that have occurred on a smaller scale this year. Were talking about continued decent payroll growth.-
The slowest and most jobless recovery since WWII. Impressive accomplishment!
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Quote from aldadoc
The slowest and most jobless recovery since WWII. Impressive accomplishment!
Compared to the rest of the developed world, yes. Impressive indeed. We avoided a potentially catastropihic austerity path coming out of the worst global economiccrisis since the great depression and are recovering decently now.-
Pure hyperbole. The recovery sucks because of the policies put into place. You can’t buff this turd.
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Quote from aldadoc
Pure hyperbole. The recovery sucks because of the policies put into place. You can’t buff this turd.
You act as though it’s Obama that’s holding the government hostage.
Where are all the economic policies form the GOP that would have made this economy grow faster than it is right now (and it IS growing by the way, as much as your myopia refuses to call it that).
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[b]The recovery sucks because of the policies put into place. You can’t buff this turd.[/b]
The stock market has Doubled under Obama
When Bush was President the Market lost 40% of value.
turd buffing is something you know well-
Kpack – “[b]When Bush was President the Market lost 40% of value.”[/b]
Panic selloffs occur and inevitanly rebound within a few months, just like the Black Monday of the eighties. So your are ascribing the inevitable stock market rebound to Obama is a crock.
Economies are judged by employment levels, GDP and mean household incomes, not by stock market fluctuations. The Bammer has a dismal economic record in all of these categories. The only growth we have seen under his is the growth in the welfare rolls and in the misery index.-
[b]Economies are judged by employment levels, GDP and mean household incomes, not by stock market fluctuations.[/b]
Alda—–Reality check
There has been no stock market fluctuation. In 5 years under Obama the stock market has doubled.
Unemployment is at its five yr low [link=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/08/01/us-unemployment-claims-fall-to-326k-5-12-year-low/]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/08/01/us-unemployment-claims-fall-to-326k-5-12-year-low/[/link]
House hold incomes are up [link=http://blogs.marketwatch.com/capitolreport/2013/07/29/first-significant-rise-in-household-income-in-over-a-year/]http://blogs.marketwatch.com/capitolreport/2013/07/29/first-significant-rise-in-household-income-in-over-a-year/[/link]
GDP is looking good [link=http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/24ece6aa-f650-11e2-8388-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2ajwZiYpi]http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/24ece6aa-f650-11e2-8388-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2ajwZiYpi[/link]
C’mon man where are you at?-
Aldadoc, do you give [i]no[/i] accomodation at all for the global financial crisis? You seem to want to only compare the current US economy to prior recession recoveries without any acknowledgement of the a) the severity of the crisis we went through, b) the global nature of the crisis and c) the USA’s outstanding performance relative to the remainder of the developed world.
Yeah, the stimulus could have been done better…. I would have prefferred it had been 2x-3x as big and concentrated around infrastructure renewal and energy R&D. Would I have done the ACA as the first piece of major legislation while economic recovery was far from certain, probably not. Those are legitimate criticisms.
Keystone, Boeing … small ‘taters.
Taxes both personal and corporate …. that requires will bipartisan help to get done …. and that just wasn’t there. The whole of taxes was messy purele plitical crisis management slop mostly caused by the GOP who just wanted to keep the Bush tax cuts.-
The employment issue is dismal. Nobody’s buying the hope and sunshine BS peddled by the Dems. Young people are sitting on their thumbs at their mom and dads’ houses watching TV, because they can’t find employment. This is a sad state of affairs. The progressives want to turn the country into Detroit.
[link=http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2013/08/the-saddest-chart-young-americans-are-simply-dropping-out.php]http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2013/08/the-saddest-chart-young-americans-are-simply-dropping-out.php[/link]
Mi casa es su casa.-
Unemployment is at its five yr low [link=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/08/01/us-unemployment-claims-fall-to-326k-5-12-year-low/]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/08/01/us-unemployment-claims-fall-to-326k-5-12-year-low/[/link]
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Quote from aldadoc
The employment issue is dismal. Nobody’s buying the hope and sunshine BS peddled by the Dems. Young people are sitting on their thumbs at their mom and dads’ houses watching TV, because they can’t find employment. This is a sad state of affairs. The progressives want to turn the country into Detroit.
[link=http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2013/08/the-saddest-chart-young-americans-are-simply-dropping-out.php]http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2013/08/the-saddest-chart-young-americans-are-simply-dropping-out.php[/link]
The author of the above blog simply takes the youth labor particpation numbers and then states they are “dropping out” of the workforce. Then shows a couple of “living in the basement” anecdotes as support for that argument.
A large portion of the decrease in youth labor participation is directly attributable to the education effect… young people divert from immediate entry to the workforce and instead defer towards education in times of economic stress. Once on that pathway there is a significant lag in the participation rate even as the economy improves as it takes a number of years to complete education.
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Yes, there has been some improvement, but going from abyssmal to horrible is not something to crow about. Coming out of a 5 year recession the US ecomomy should be humming at >4% GDP growth and < 5% unemployment. We’re not even close to that.
I truly don’t see a cause for celebration. This used to be known as stagnation. -
Once again, I know I sound like a broken record,…. but when the rest of the developed world is doing 0% growth and global demand is in the sh*tter, 1-2% GDP positive with steady 200k-ish jobs is good.
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Quote from dergon
Once again, I know I sound like a broken record,…. but when the rest of the developed world is doing 0% growth and global demand is in the sh*tter, 1-2% GDP positive with steady 200k-ish jobs is good.
+1. I like to listen to bloomberg sometimes one the way in. They had an economist on this morning that seemed to echo this sentiment. The economy isn’t growing at a blistering pace but it’s still been fairly steady month – month. Which leads you to believe things are stabilizing.
As far as unemployment it’s too bad people don’t have the skill sets to match jobs. If I look on the job board here just for IT related jobs I think they’ve got 12 pages posted of various positions, from DBAs and Analysts to Management.
I was out golfing with buddy that’s a PGA pro and coaches a local high school. We were talking with one of his players that is in college now and works at the course. He changed his major to marketing. My question was do you want to get a job when you graduate? Go into Science, Technical, Engineering. -
Try a new argument, China, the most populous country in the wold, and the second largest economy, has been growing at a nearly 10% GDP growth rate during that period and India at a rate of about 7%. The US hasn’t broken 2% since the Bush years.
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Try a new argument, China, the most populous country in the wold, and the second largest economy, has been growing at a nearly 10% GDP growth rate during that period and India at a rate of about 7%. The US hasn’t broken 2% since the Bush years.
You must have missed the word “developed”. Your arguments are often a bit of a stretch, but to try to make some judgement on the quality of US economic growth because China, the largest [i]developing[/i] nation on the face of the earth, is growing faster shows either a lack of understanding of economics or a wanton disregard for facts.
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But really that is the crux of the belief system of the right…they want China’s economy with wealth and capital in the hands of the few (in their case corportists rather than govt) and to he11 with the rest of us. To them the Wal-mart business model is the best in the world
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Quote from aldadoc
Try a new argument, China, the most populous country in the wold, and the second largest economy, has been growing at a nearly 10% GDP growth rate during that period and India at a rate of about 7%. The US hasn’t broken 2% since the Bush years.
Google China Ghost Cities. You’ll find that they’ve built entire cities that nobody lives in. All to keep their GDP up.
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Own it guys, your hope n’ change economy sucks.
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Obama after 5 years owns a lot if this
He owns the doubling of the stock market
He owns the unemployment rate dropping from 10 to 7.4%
He owns ending Iraq
He owns bringing Bin Laden to justice
He owns the ACA
There is no denying ownership
You think all these things are terrible. And you are in the minority
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Own it guys, your hope n’ change economy sucks.
Says the one who wants us to aspire to be like China -
Labor participation rate at lowest level on history, highest corporate taxes in the world, anemic job growth, record high food stamps, welfare, disability and unemployment benefits. Yeah, he owns it alright. Glad to see you are so happy with this incompetent administration.
BTW, Bin Laden was caught thanks to intelligence obtained thanks to Bush’s CIA interrogation policies. Obama was the beneficiary of the previous administration’s efforts. Interesting how this is the only thing he takes ownership of. The one thing that he really didn’t have much to do with. -
Quote from aldadoc
Labor participation rate at lowest level on history, highest corporate taxes in the world, anemic job growth, record high food stamps, welfare, disability and unemployment benefits. Yeah, he owns it alright. Glad to see you are so happy with this incompetent administration.
BTW, Bin Laden was caught thanks to intelligence obtained thanks to Bush’s CIA interrogation policies. Obama was the beneficiary of the previous administration’s efforts. Interesting how this is the only thing he takes ownership of. The one thing that he really didn’t have much to do with.
Highest corporate taxes yet at the same time it’s also the highest corporate profits. -
Then you wonder why US corporations park their cash profits overseas! Apple has $82 billion parked overseas. Under a normal administration, that money would be put to work in the US.
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Yeah basically Apple has money sitting in US banks that are digitally assigned to Ireland. The money is only figuratively offshore. And of course they developed this tax haven strategy during the Reagan administration….but yeah its all cuz of Obama
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Quote from aldadoc
Then you wonder why US corporations park their cash profits overseas! Apple has $82 billion parked overseas. Under a normal administration, that money would be put to work in the US.
Alda, what are the top present and historical marginal corporate tax rates since, say 1950?
While you’re at it, what are the top present and historical individual tax rates in the same period?
How about Capital Gains rates in the same period?
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Wake up Rip Van Winkle! Don’t you think that there could be a correlation between having the highest corporate tax rates in the world and loss of jobs, manufacturing base and competitiveness?
Historicals don’t play a role anymore. We are in a new wold, where we no longer have the advantages of the past. Education levels, access to a workforce and standad of living is now better in many parts of the world than in the US. There are stable banking systems elsewhere and low tax heavens like Singapore. We can no longer afford the luxury of high taxes and suffocating regulation. Companies and the jobs they create will just go elsewhere. -
Quote from aldadoc
Wake up Rip Van Winkle!
Last time I checked, [u]YOU[/u] were the one still living in WWII!
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Quote from aldadoc
Then you wonder why US corporations park their cash profits overseas! Apple has $82 billion parked overseas. Under a normal administration, that money would be put to work in the US.
perhaps some of it but Apple might even do something crazy like pay a divided that get’s taxed and reinvested, spent, saved by the share holder. -
Libs, here’s a new concept: The money that people and comapanies earn through hard work, innovation or good planning is not your money, it is their money.
Simple concept, really. -
Quote from aldadoc
Libs, here’s a new concept: The money that people and comapanies earn through hard work, innovation or good planning is not your money, it is their money.
Simple concept, really.
In the case of Apple isn’t it the share holders money? The shareholders own the company.
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Shareholders/company comme ci, comme ca. Point is, it is not the governments money or the puppetteer elite liberals money, unless you own the stock, Then you are welcome to donate your dividend toward the tax pool.
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“standad of living is now better in many parts of the world than in the US”
Questions for Alda:
What country is this?
What is the form of government?
What is the health care system? -
Here you go Thor some references below: Does it really matter what their health care system is? The fact is that these countries can now effectively compete with us on a level field. If our corporate tax or regulatory structure is too burdensome, companies will set up shop elsewhere. No different than Texas taking jobs away from California. Simple math, really.
[link=http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/23/us-students-still-lag-beh_n_1695516.html]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/23/us-students-still-lag-beh_n_1695516.html[/link]
[link=http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?2441616-New-research-The-US-ranks-27th-in-the-world-when-it-comes-to-middle-class-wealth]http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?2441616-New-research-The-US-ranks-27th-in-the-world-when-it-comes-to-middle-class-wealth[/link]
[link=http://www.middleclasspoliticaleconomist.com/2013/06/us-median-wealth-only-28th-in-world.html]http://www.middleclasspoliticaleconomist.com/2013/06/us-median-wealth-only-28th-in-world.html[/link]
[link=http://www.businessinsider.com/top-countries-on-oecd-better-life-index-2013-5?op=1]http://www.businessinsider.com/top-countries-on-oecd-better-life-index-2013-5?op=1[/link]
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Alda
Many of those companies listed under the hannity link are those European style socialist countries that you loathe
Alda, read your links before you place your foot in your mouth. You are making this too easy
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Quote from aldadoc
Libs, here’s a new concept: The money that people and comapanies earn through hard work, innovation or good planning is not your money, it is their money.
Simple concept, really.
Maybe a simple concept, but it’s incorrect.
Our gross paycheck money obviously is NOT ours. Anyone who thinks it is, is simply delusional. You act as though we give our taxes to the government out of the goodness of our heart. Well I have news for you, that money MUST be shed and was NEVER ours to begin with. Rather, it pays for things we need from the federal government.
In that sense, we simply are couriers from the employer to the federal coffers, no other agreement stated or implied. Anyone who claims that all of that money is “ours” for even a split second is simply and completely naive, and does not understand practical economics.
Grow up before you grow old.
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Quote from aldadoc
Then you wonder why US corporations park their cash profits overseas! Apple has $82 billion parked overseas. Under a normal administration, that money would be put to work in the US.
What a silly rant. Get your facts straight. Apple puts its money overseas because they are [i][u]allowed[/u][/i] to do that thanks to the trade laws that are supported, in part, by the [i][u]Republican[/u][/i] party! I don’t recall you complaining about Romney doing the same thing in Cayman banks. I guess you must hold that against Bush then, too, no?
And I suppose you also blame the Obama administration for allowing Big Oil to bathe in a $40 billion federal subsidy too? Like that’s a problem caused by Democrats?
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Quote from aldadoc
Try a new argument, China, the most populous country in the wold, and the second largest economy, has been growing at a nearly 10% GDP growth rate during that period and India at a rate of about 7%. The US hasn’t broken 2% since the Bush years.
China’s economy is a house of cards and there already are reports that it’s on the verge of toppling.
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Quote from kpack123
[b]Economies are judged by employment levels, GDP and mean household incomes, not by stock market fluctuations.[/b]
Alda—–Reality check
There has been no stock market fluctuation. In 5 years under Obama the stock market has doubled.
Unemployment is at its five yr low [link=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/08/01/us-unemployment-claims-fall-to-326k-5-12-year-low/]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/08/01/us-unemployment-claims-fall-to-326k-5-12-year-low/[/link]
House hold incomes are up [link=http://blogs.marketwatch.com/capitolreport/2013/07/29/first-significant-rise-in-household-income-in-over-a-year/]http://blogs.marketwatch.com/capitolreport/2013/07/29/first-significant-rise-in-household-income-in-over-a-year/[/link]
GDP is looking good [link=http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/24ece6aa-f650-11e2-8388-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2ajwZiYpi]http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/24ece6aa-f650-11e2-8388-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2ajwZiYpi[/link]
C’mon man where are you at?
And public opinion of the GOP is in the toilet compared to the Bush days.
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Quote from aldadoc
The slowest and most jobless recovery since WWII. Impressive accomplishment!
As if there was anything about the economic terrain anywhere on planet Earth today that remotely resembles the economy back during WWII.
You’ve GOT to be kidding.
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How about not spending a $Trillion on “stimulus” for “shovel ready” projects that never materialized, or not passing a multi-tillion dollar socialized health care plan (Obamacare), or not increasing taxes during a recession, or revamping the corporate tax rates, or not blocking the Keystone pipeline, or not sueing Boeing for trying to open up a plant in a non-union state, or not supporting the public sector unions …. should I continue?
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Quote from aldadoc
Yes, there has been some improvement, but going from abyssmal to horrible is not something to crow about. Coming out of a 5 year recession the US ecomomy should be humming at >4% GDP growth and < 5% unemployment. We're not even close to that.
Of course that's simply your opinion. And of course you have no factual basis for that opinion at all. There has been no comparable recession in our modern style economy that would give us any basis to predict what it takes to recover to this or that level.
On the other hand, two facts that we DO have is an unemployment rate that has gone from 10.3 to 7.4%, and a monthly jobs rate of MINUS 800,000 per month to PLUS 150,000 to 200,000 per month. And that gives a factual metric showing that the improvement has indeed been "something to crow about".
But I guess that's just MY opinion.
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No Alda
If Obama owns the current labor and employment market which he inherited
He also owns the government policies as per intelligence.
He owns GITMO…. He owns killing OBL
You can’t cherry pick
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[b]Point is, it is not the governments money or the puppetteer elite liberals money, unless you own the stock,[/b]
Actually Taxation is the way the government gets money. Of course no one likes to pay them but when China steals Apples name and sells Fake I phones and I pods and tries to Pirate Apple Software. Who does Apple run to to be the policeman for them?
No one likes to pay taxes but Who pays the salary of the Military who defend your country?
Who foots the bill for the technology that comes with protecting the Nation?
Who Builds the Bridges the roads the schools?
Are these the evil Puppet elite liberals you talk about?
I agree that sky high tax rates can stifle economic growth. But the rates are not sky high
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[b]”No one likes to pay taxes but Who pays the salary of the Military who defend your country? [/b]
[b]Who foots the bill for the technology that comes with protecting the Nation? [/b]
[b]Who Builds the Bridges the roads the schools?”[/b]
[b] [/b]
[b]”Are these the evil Puppet elite liberals you talk about?”[/b]
[b] [/b]
Nah!! It’s those illegals, welfare and food stamp scammers, Solendra bucks grabbers, line dancing lessons for the obummers government workers off-site conventions idiots, obummers many golf outings, beer summits and et.al. liberals I am talking about. Speaking of that technology – does that include spy technology to further erode our liberties guaranteed by the Constitution. I’m sure a big chunk of change will have to go toward defending ol’ holder and the rest of the hoard of huns from Chicago when their criminal trials start. If we are lucky the obummer will be included in that group.
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Lux, being a student of history does not equate to being old or asleep. I suggesrt you read Santayana and his thoughts on knowing history. It may serve you well.
BTW, other people’s money is not your money.-
Kpack, you are missing the point. Companies will take their business where they can operate and generate a profit. It may not be Sweeden, but there are many other choices, like Ireland, with lower corporate taxes than the US, a reasonable regulatory structure and an educated workforce.
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And how is Ireland’s economy doing??? How much real value are they deriving???
And go back to your list and look at the form of govt and tax policies of those countries with a better middle class and then look at the difference between their middle class and highest paid. Then explain how the US differs….-
[link=http://www.tradingeconomics.com/ireland/gdp-growth]http://www.tradingeconomics.com/ireland/gdp-growth[/link]
Wow that tax policy is really kicking growth up…-
If they hadn’t attracted American capital, their GDP would have been even worse. Can’t blame them for enticing US companies.
The US used to dominate the world economy by a large margin. If we keep losing capital and manufacturing capabilities we will lose what used to be thought to be an unsurmountable advantage.
Job growth requires a favorable corporate environment. Unions, high taxes and over-regulation are inhibitors of risk-taking and job growth. Maybe one of you can explain this to your idol president if you can take your nose out of his arse for a few seconds.-
Employment indicators
[link=http://hotair.com/archives/2013/08/02/five-scary-charts-and-facts-about-whos-working-and-not-working-in-this-economy/]http://hotair.com/archive…rking-in-this-economy/[/link]-
“Unions, high-taxes, and over-regulation” also makes sure your reading room doesn’t burn down with everyone inside it like sweatshops in asia, it makes sure you don’t have TB when you go to work, and makes it impossible for your boss to fire you because of what religion you practice.
Republicans must realize that a lot of the country is comprised of liberals, and that liberals will eventually make their way into representative government. They must learn to accept that certain liberal policies will make up the fabric of America, and have done so since its inception. It can’t all be based on Reagan and the bible, unfortunately.
The more pressing issue for conservatives, is how are they ever going to get back into power? Is there a single republican front-runner for President that could actually get 270? Does any republican actually think they can take the senate in 2014? Are republicans still in “Romney will be elected President” denial that Rove was in after the election?
If conservatives want to have the same voice as liberals anytime in the near future, they are going to have to get their act together. All you have right now is someone who was born in Canada and someone who wants to dismantle our military as the tea party favorites, and one NJ governor who won’t make it past any primary. Then you have the gentleman from Florida who got nervous giving a “rebuttal” address and can’t even get his party to agree with him on immigration reform. Seriously, what have you got?
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Question ALDA
The graph shows % of workforce between 25 and 54 years is down 2% in 5 yrs
Isn’t this just demographics as the Baby boomers continue to age
Your posting a lot of graphs and links and article………..but do you even know what they mean?
Again What happened to you?-
Quote from kpack123
Question ALDA
The graph shows % of workforce between 25 and 54 years is down 10% in 5 yrs
Isn’t this just demographics as the Baby boomers continue to age
Your posting a lot of graphs and links and article………..but do you even know what they mean?
Again What happened to you?
Kpack, don’t play stupid with deceptive information. You know damn well that even though the US population growth RATE decreased after the baby boomers, the US population growed more from 1964 on than it did during the equivalent baby boomer years of 1946-1964. In fact, the biggest driver to US population now is immigration.
So in essence, to answer your question: No, it is not just demographics, it is unemployment and underemployment. Now, have a nice weekend. I’m done doing your research.
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[b]You know damn well that even though the US population growth RATE decreased after the baby boomers, the US population growed more from 1964 on than it did during the equivalent baby boomer years of 1946-1964. In fact, the biggest driver to US population now is immigration. [/b]
Your link and your chart suggested there were fewer younger workers in the work over the pasttt 5 years. Then you extrapolated some B.S. argument as to why.
The workforce is aging disproportionately because Baby boomers are reaching the upper limits. This basically blows any of the ridiculous claims you or the author of that graph extrapolated from the data
You can post a statistic then make a claim………………….but it doesn’t make 2+2 =5
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